You owe it to yourself to read the comment from Fran, dated 8/07 regarding her NIGHTMARE experience, before you make your decision about what to buy!
"house was completed on 8/06. I have had non stop problems. The cabinet
upgrades are a disaster. the closets collapsed. the waterheater was
installed incorrectly and needed to be replaced. water leaks keep
spurting up from under the house. all the connections are leaking. The
joist is bent and the floors are loose and creak and click and squeek.
Two windows are very crooked (beyond variance). The faucets
malfunctioned and had to be replaced. the outside lights did not
work.My dream is a constant nightmare. My contracter saw a single woman
and put a big X on "a potential sucker". But I am fighting and will not
give up. The company in Arizona denighs most issues but constant
communication is beginning to get a response (one year later)I have
saved all documentation and will expect to get things fixed. If anyone
has a lawsuit in progress I will join?"
Doesn't this comment, when combined with the other comments and entries in this blog, call into question the wisdom of investing your hard earned money in a product that is consistently flawed and defective?
8/22/2007 7:47 AM
Allan Mercer wrote:
I would be quite interested to find out if anyone has considered a class action suit against Champion Enterprises, Inc. and Redman. I will occasionally visit this blog for responses. I need to give it some thought, but I may also submit an eight page letter that I sent to William C. Griffiths, President, CEO and Chairman of the Board of Champion Enterprises, Inc. regarding the problems associated with our Redman home manufactured in Chandler, AZ. and purchased in 2005. AM Reply to this
8/23/2007 10:07 AM
Mike wrote:
Allan, At this point in time, lawsuits and or class action lawsuits are indeed under consideration and being researched by serveral individuals.
We also sent a several page letter to William C. Griffiths and to several highly positioned corporate staff detailing our specific problems and heard absolutely nothing from any of them. As stated frequently on this blog, it is obvious they do not care about their customers!
I would encourage you to submit your letter so that people in similar circumstances can compare notes and to warn potential buyers what kind of nightmare they can expect if they purchase a Champion Genesis Redman product.
8/23/2007 9:35 AM
Gavin wrote:
What do most people expect. After doing plenty of research into the modular construction standards, I have noticed a growing trend. People want the biggest, best homes with all of the bells and whistles and want to pay as little as possible for it. When researching and doing independent polling on Home builders, 90% of customers #1 demand is the "cheapest home you can give me". Well, you get what you pay for.
Try this, go car shopping. Go to the local Kia dealership and ask for a car that has full leather interior, sunroof, navigation package, etc. etc. Probably won't get it. Now go to your local Mercedes dealership and ask for the same thing, of course you are going to get it, but no where near the cost of a Kia.
If you are not going to get these results in an automobile, why on earth would you expect to get it out of a HOME!
If you want a quality built home, whether it be Manufactured Homes, Modular Homes, or site built homes, do some research. And by research, I do not mean what builder can give you the cheapest house. And if that is the route you are going, do not complain about what you paid for. Reply to this
8/24/2007 1:53 PM
Mike wrote:
Question,given your email address, are you a former car salesman turned Palm Harbor, Discover Custom Homes and Nationwide Homes salesman? Just maybe, it is your customers who are asking you for the "cheapest home you can give me" and not the customers interested in competitive products...you think?
Just by co-incidence, I have been driving Mercedes Benz cars since the late seventies. And yes, they are a more refined form of transportation than a Kia. However, the quality and reliability has gone downhill as they added more bells and whistles. In fact, our next car will be either a BMW or a Camry, so much for the car shopping analogy.
What people expect, and you should know this, given Palm Harbor's history, is a product free of defects and poor workmanship. It is not as you describe, shopping for the cheapest product that is the root of the problem. Building a quality product is not dependent upon having "all the bells and whistles" as much as one taking pride in the quality of the workmanship. As a matter of fact, isn't Palm Harbor's mission statement "Build and sell customers' dream homes that exceed their expectation."
Champion Genesis would take great umbrage with your insinuation that their product is "cheap." Just look at all their sales materials, websites, magazine articles and listen to their salesmen.
You are right about doing research, you can never do enough!
10/11/2007 12:19 AM
kevin wrote:
I purchased a Home in 2000. I'm am not looking for all the bells and whistles. I want plumbing that does not have screws drilled into it. I want a house that is not setting on a water line to the shower. I want a home that does not have a vapor panel(pool liner) full of water and a collapsed floor. I would like to get away from the mold. I wish my ductwork was connected and was not full of leaks.I wish I did not have a $20,000 second mortgage to cover the repairs. I wish I could obtain insurance without the state helping me. I wish the company would help me I'm ruined. Reply to this
8/23/2007 3:33 PM
Allan Mercer wrote:
Have any readers of this blog tried to send a letter to Redman Homes in Chandler, AZ? I attempted to send copies of my letters to the factory; a copy each of two letters I sent to Mr. Griffiths at Champion Enterprises, Inc. corporate headquarters in Michigan. Both copies to the factory were returned to me. Since I don't tend to give up easily it became quite a sluething job. The last factory address I knew about was on Ray Road in Chandler, AZ. The new factory address seems to be located on the "Gila River Indian Community" (Reservation). I wonder why the factory moved to this new location? The factory management must not have left a forwarding address because both were returned to me marked, "moved" or "not at this (Ray Road) address". Here is what I believe to be the new address: Redman Homes, DBA Champion Home Builders, 6420 West Allison Road, Lone Butte, AZ Note: there is no zip code provided for Redman. 'Lone Butte' is the name of an industrial park...so add: C/O Lone Butte Industrial Park, 6960 West Allison Road, Box 5000, Chandler AZ 85226. If mailing to Redman I would urge you to discuss this with your postmaster/mistress. There seem to be several suite numbers and several ZIP + four digets in the industrial park. It remains to be seen if my mailings will be returned to me. AM Reply to this
8/23/2007 7:01 PM
Mike wrote:
The following address came from the card of Jay Angus, General Manager of the Champion/Redman plant in Arizona. As of 03/12/2007 the address was still good.
Champion Home Builders 6420 W Allison Rd. Chandler, Az 85226-5198
The letter we sent to Jay Angus in Arizona was delivered.
8/23/2007 4:44 PM
Joen Edwards wrote:
I have read a couple of blogs reqgarding Champion Homes.
In all fairness, the question becomes why Champion homes will not fix the described problems> There must be something not told with this story. Also, a real important question is, how many homes do champion build per year and how many problems arise. That really would let me know if one should purchase a champion home.
To hear one out of 100 homes is bad would be very unfair to classify this company as a terrible modular home builder.
BUT, as I am well aware, champion should help if these accusations are valid.
Hence, wish I could find out how many Clients does champion have annually and what is the satifaction rate for these clients. If 2 out of 100 is disassified, that is not a bad ratio at all. Any suggestions as to finding out this question / concern / ratio?? Reply to this
8/24/2007 2:56 PM
Mike wrote:
Please see entry dated 08/24/07 re: Champion Genesis Modular NIGHTMARE!
Mr. William C. Griffiths, Chairman, CEO and President Champion Enterprises, Inc. 2701 Cambridge Court Suite 300 Auburn Hills, MI 48326
Dear Chairman Griffiths,
This is the first report to you, but undoubtedly not the last, regarding various issues with our Champion (Redman) home. We purchased this home March 2005 from your Chandler, AZ plant.
Let me say that I appreciate the fact that these housing units are less costly than “stick built” houses, due to numerous cost saving measures. Some of these cost saving measures are no doubt attributed to factory methods, quantity material purchases and labor. However, cost cutting by using cheap materials and shoddy construction are inexcusable and certainly do not fare well for your company. Negative issues need to be researched, examined and corrected. A poor product reflects on Champion Enterprises, Inc. and all of its subsidiaries.
My letter intends to address kitchen cabinets in generally and our cabinets specifically. On August 1, my wife and I were shocked when a large CRASH occurred someplace in our Redman Homes, Inc. built house. Upon conducting a bit of investigation I found the lower two-thirds of what we refer to as our “pantry” had collapsed and all the lower shelves had fallen upon themselves leaving a jumble of food products in a heap. I will not try to dramatize this incident by telling you various glass jars were broken and liquid and semi-liquid food stuffs were leaking out upon the kitchen floor from the bottom of the cabinet, because that was not the case. It could have been a much bigger mess and we would have been that much more upset. We were fortunate, but that does not eliminate the time my wife had to take from her day to remove all this material and for us to determine a logical course of corrective action.
We have enclosed, for your viewing pleasure, pictures of this mess.
I’m sure you can determine from these pictures exactly what occurred to cause this problem. The plastic shelf holders did not hold the shelves and everything collapsed. During the collapse the exposed side of this cabinet bowed outward. In our humble opinion we do not believe we did anything unusual or extreme to cause this situation. And we note that shelves in some of our other kitchen cabinets are bowing downward with the weight of typical empty plates, glasses and other service wear. Are these kitchen cabinets not really intended for use in the kitchen?
I wanted to get this letter off quickly after the incident, but I intend to send you at least one more letter identifying relative simple and straight forward problems with our home. In our opinion, this kitchen cabinet shelf collapse is just one example of the use of inferior or substandard hardware, marginal materials and poor workmanship.
8/24/2007 11:15 AM
Allan wrote:
(Part Two) It concerns us, because we spent a considerable amount of money preparing this site, buying this Redman home, having it delivered to the site, installing everything required by code to obtain an occupancy permit and we shouldered many additional costs required by the County of San Diego and the State of California. All this has been a considerable expense and now we have to determine what course of action we should take regarding kitchen cabinets. On one hand should I have all the cabinets demolished and pay a competent cabinet maker to ‘re-cabinet’ the kitchen? Or should I go to Home Depot and purchase substantial metal hardware to hold up the sagging shelves? And if new hardware is added we are not convinced the shelves will be sufficient to hold our goods.
As I said earlier, these sorts of issues reflect poorly upon your company, your subsidiaries and your product. After having lived in this house for over sixteen months we can truthfully state that we generally enjoy our home. We have offered to open our home to anyone interested in purchasing your product. How do we explain the cabinet issue to a prospective customer of yours touring our home?
I urge you to direct that an immediate correction to this specific problem be made at all your plants and that your company make amends to your customers, people like us, who purchased your product. And in closing, I will follow this letter with at least one more, identifying other issues regarding this home, such as external cracks in the walls, substandard electrical wiring, misaligned doors, and other matters I will not bore you with at this time.
If you need more information or want to question me, please do not hesitate to contact me via any of the possible communication links below.
10/11/2007 12:52 AM
kevin wrote:
I purchased A dutch home from Indiana in 2000. The floor collapsed in 2004. I did not know that I had a screw drilled into the plumbing from construction. The vapor barrier under the home acted as a pool liner. I had a foot of water under my kitchen. In September of 2006 I found standing water in my bathroom. After gutting the bathroom and bedroom floor and partition wall we found a pinched plumbing line. The line was pinched between the floor joist and the sill plate of foundation. Just as before we had about a foot of water and mold. We also found out why the ductwork never worked on the north side of the home. The holes in the trunk line looked as if they were cut with an ax. We had major leaks under the home. Other issues include leaking skylights and water tank hooked up backwards. Phone calls, letters and emails with pictures was of no use. The service could not have been worse. I now have a second mortgage of $20,000. I can not get insurance at a reasonable rate . I'm ruined and losing my ability to provide for my family. Attorneys want a specialist for manufactured homes before taking the case. That is the closest i've been able to get in finding an attorney to help me. I can't find a Specialist. I see that the parent company at the other end of the continent is as my company. Very poor quality worse service. I wish to join a class action suit. I sure wish our government cared about us. Reply to this
8/31/2008 3:18 PM
susan cowgill wrote:
STOP, if you have water leaks for more than 24 hours you have MOLD thanks to redman champion, as all of you we trusted a sales person, this company DOESN'T care, as long as they get their money. my husband are now sick with MOLD we had to sell our business just to pay for attorneys we are going into our 3 years of a law suits, it has cost us over 1 million dollars.call the TV station, The state attorneys general office, News papers.the word need's to go out so these people can't distroy any more lives. they are nation wide take a stand let your voice be heard we have to STOP this company Reply to this
